[Discussion] Androctonus spp.

Great shots as always bro!
And nice avatar

5i male on heavy premolt



4i unsexed

Thanks guys!

DolblyR,
That is one FAT 5i male "sausage"!
Seems to be growing fairly fast under your care

This specimen yes
The other one seems to grow significantly slower although it is being kept at the same conditions.

Will re-sex it again though, after it molts. The last pectine shot I did was not 100% clear, and I sexed it as "normal" A.b., the aeneas morph however, has slightly different PTC for males and females.

Here's something that I haven't read in any of the threads and maybe it's because not everyone keeps their andro's in a communal setting, since they are not suppose to be communal. I've not witnessed many molts of my andro's, because I've only kept a few in deli cups or should I say small separate containers. I have kept mine in a communal setting and what I've noticed is that whenever they are about molt they bury themselves deep in the substrate. My tank has appeared empty for as long as 2 weeks. Not a scorpion in site. In fact that's what cured my mite problem, that I ask about in one of my post. During the molt to 5i the scorpions stayed underground for over 14 days and that just happen to be the life span of the mites. When they surfaced there was not a mite to be seen.

I'm not recommending anyone keep their andro's communally. I'm just sharing information. One of the things that I had read was andro's didn't burrow and when mine did, it confused me. Now I know they really only do it just before they molt. FYI!!!

tfleming Bro,

Thanks for sharing these. Yes, you are one of the few i know of who has tried communal setup of A.australis slings. I'm sure your breeding report would be a good reference. I might have missed out on your previous posts, hence, some queries i have in mind:

1. Do you happen to have sample pics (before and after) on the A.australis mites issue you mentioned?

2. Is your substrate pure sand or you have used mixture (sand/clay) to allow stable burrowing?

Answer to the 1st question. Yes, I have pic's with mites and without mites.
1. Look at the Telson. These were 4i.

2. Close up! They had them on their legs, bellies, everywhere but there eye. I thought for sure I'd loose them.

3. Here is the culprit. Notice the feet/legs.

4. After the molt to 5i.

5.

6.


Now for the 2nd question. Yes, I have a mix of sand/clay. I thank God they made it. These guys/girls have been through a lot and they have made it this far. They're tough!!!

Okay.. now i recalled

I'm not sure if it's the burrowing and staying underground which "kills" the mites but i would think it is the moult that attributes to the removal of mites on the scorpions. It is still recommended to do a full substrate overhaul (ignore if you have already done so) although mites usually flourish in forest enclosures.

Just like mild mycosis occurring in desert scorpions, a moult would sometimes "cure" the scorpion, just like giving the scorpion a reborn and fresh body as long as the previous mycosis is not severe and has spread unto the internal organs of the scorpion.

As for the burrowing, that might explains something here. As you already know, scorpions are generally reclusive and prefer hiding as compared to exposing themselves. They usually surface only for specific purposes. E.g. Hunting for prey, seeking water source, seeking spots with their desired humidity/ temperature, providing a perimeter defense in the vicinity of their hide, and probably on the lookout for potential mate(for sexually matured adults).

Therefore, they will always like to hide under something like a slate/hide. When a keeper has provided a well packed substrate or customized sand/clay substrate that would hold a burrow well, the scorpions would usually not hesitate to do some digging where they can find their serenity in the darkness of their burrow and also to regulate a desired humidity/ temperature.

Quote :

I'm not sure if it's the burrowing and staying underground which "kills" the mites but i would think it is the moult that attributes to the removal of mites on the scorpions.

I agree it was the combination. The molt removed them and being underground with no way to breed and reproduce they died. Changing the substrate, keeping the tank hot and dry, they just couldn't survive.

tfleming wrote:

I agree it was the combination. The molt removed them and being underground with no way to breed and reproduce they died. Changing the substrate, keeping the tank hot and dry, they just couldn't survive.

Well done!

GS wrote:

Mating one of my Androctonus bicolor Adult Pair

I was filled with joy and satisfaction to watch two scorps which i've raised from 2nd instar successfully mate at the very first attempt.
It was indeed a awesome experience to nurture them through their different molting stages.. till their final adulthood

Click here to view all:

Sensing something was fishy when the cave's entrance has been sealed up..


Apart from the joy of raising this specific adult pair from 2.instar all the way till 7.instar,
these are the presents after 9 months of gestation

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More pics/vid updates coming up.. as well as Androctonus bicolor ASA and full breeding report to share

Regards,
GS

Great pics bro...as always

Not sure if it has been covered earlier in the thread, but does A. bicolor show sexual dimorphism on the chelae?

DolbyR wrote:

Great pics bro...as always
Not sure if it has been covered earlier in the thread, but does A. bicolor show sexual dimorphism on the chelae?

Thanks bro

No significant difference in chela comparison.
As you know, the more accurate sexing method is via pectine tooth count.

In term of physical difference by comparing a 7.instar adult pair (side by side with each other), usually males have a leaner body mass and fatter tail to body ratio. Female's tail could be as large as male's but her larger body mass would be a gentle giveaway.

Yep, I agree with PCT being the most accurate, atleast in 90% of the time. Unfortunately one of my specimens falls on that 10% (or less) when PCT alone is not enough. I guess I'll have to wait both to get to adulthood for a good comparison and pray for the best.

Yes, there's always the 10% that falls on the silver lining between male and female.
Just to share, my males are usually around 27-28 PTC if i remember correctly.

Yep, wait for your pair to be adult and it shall be clearer.
Not to worry on shortage thou

Awesome pics GS, congrats!

Wow, I know what you mean about the feeling of growing them from 2i to adulthood. They aren't mine and I'm feeling it. Thanks for sharing!!! BTW congrats!!!

Scorpion19981000 wrote:

Awesome pics GS, congrats!

Thanks bro!

tfleming wrote:

Wow, I know what you mean about the feeling of growing them from 2i to adulthood. They aren't mine and I'm feeling it. Thanks for sharing!!! BTW congrats!!!

It's a pretty long & "hard-earned" wait of about 16 months as i have started this project from 2.instar. However, the satisfaction achieved is "unmatchable"!
Thanks for sharing the joy

GS wrote:

It's a pretty long & "hard-earned" wait of about 16 months as i have started this project from 2.instar. However, the satisfaction achieved is "unmatchable"!
Thanks for sharing the joy

+1

Mine are 5i now, and I'm impatiently waiting for those last 2 molts

Btw., have you noticed any difference in growth rates between males/females?

DolbyR wrote:

Btw., have you noticed any difference in growth rates between males/females?

Considering getting a group of specimen from a single brood and placing them under the same conditions and feeding regime, females are usually the ones to reach maturity first. This observation is done on 10 specimens only hence i do not speak for all A.bicolor specimens. This time round, i will observe the growth rate of the whole brood if possible and offer a more extensive data collection.

DolbyR wrote:

Mine are 5i now, and I'm impatiently waiting for those last 2 molts

Depending on your feeding regime, from 5-6.instar, they usually happen in 1-2 months interval.
For 6-7.instar, 2-3 months interval

Dismounting from mom's back:

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Left two of her favorite kids still handing around

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3x Tackle box housing for the kids :happy:

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And the cycle continues..

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Brood size: 51

Regards,
GS

Great pics bro.

Love the "Triangle of Death"

Very nice GS! Hopefully mine also drop in a few months. This would be my first time breeding Androctonus spp.

51 wow! Great shoots!

Awesome pics GS. I like the last one the best.